Blog on the Lillypad
Tuesday, August 10, 2004
 | The Story that grows and growsI posted yesterday about the lamentable case of a "pastor" who went trolling on the Fighting Fundamentalist Forum under an alias, got caught, and now is using a cover story to deny that he ever actually posted as the troll "Over It". My belief is that Marty did it so that he could maintain a certain dignity under his "Pastor" facade while giving himself venting room and then a certain sense of power in being as malicious as he liked as Over It. |
So how do you tell if a person is lying? Well, you consider if the story he tells is credible. According to Marty, he "created" the screen name but then had nothing to do with it. That alone is pretty incredible. Most people create their own screen names. This idea of passing off a screen name is pretty loopy.
You also look to see if a story changes, and it has. And you look to see if a story told does not match what is actually going on. Here are Marty's three versions of the development of the troll, "Over It,":
Re: PMB--WHY DID YOU EDIT & DELETE OLD POST?
Posted by Pastor Marty Braemer on Aug-8-04 11:39pm
(In reply to: PMB--WHY DID YOU EDIT & DELETE OLD POST? posted by emptytomb on Aug-8-04 11:36pm)
The Over It secret... I have been accused of being over It. I'm not. I did create his name but he is actually three people who share his password.
The name is my creation. The content of comments are his (them).
+++++++++++
Re: It's Not Me
Posted by Pastor Marty Braemer on Aug-9-04 2:30pm
(In reply to: It's Me posted by Over It on Aug-9-04 1:01pm)
As I stated last night and Scott mentioned, the idea of Over It was mine. I do not post as Over It or write his/their material. Think whatever else you like.
[SNIP]
Scott didn't go to HAC. In fact he does not even have an IFB background. This place and the contents of the posts here have been topics of conversations I have had with many of my friends. Some lurk here but never post. Scott and two others (no not deacons) post their own thoughts and comments. I have stayed out of that.
There have been times I have told them to tone it down.
[SNIP]
I do not post as Over It. Now, if OI makes a follow up post or adds to this thread I will let you in on a little secret... It's still not me.
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Last Time...
Posted by Pastor Marty Braemer on Aug-9-04 5:30pm
I am not Over It. Why is it so hard for you to accept that I sat down with some friends and having a few laughs over the nonsense that goes on in here that the idea for Over It came up?
Yes, I had a part in creating him. No I do not and have not posted as Over It.
So there are problems with Marty's versions of the story. First, he denies ever posting as Over It, yet he acknowledges that the guy who allegedly does post as Over It never went to Hyles-Anderson College. So how does Over It post so knowledgeably about HAC? Second, he switches from the "I just passed it on" version to acknowledging to sitting down with friends and working on the concept of Over It. Indeed, posting under Over It, he or one of his boy-toys acknowledged that Marty developed the concept of Over and the plan of how he would behave. That's a lot more than just creating a screen name. By the end of Marty's three accounts, the story has moved from Marty handing over a name to somebody else to Marty sitting down with several people and developing a plan for a character and how that character will behave. Marty also asserts that he retained control over "Over It" when he admits that at times he told his alleged accomplices to "tone it down".
It's pretty clear that as pastor of his church and the guy in charge, that Marty's been engaging in the power play thrill of getting some of his more sheep-like followers to play his game along with him. This is the genuine Hyles training in evidence. A church leadership becomes a gang of thugs who operate in secret and make back room deals. I've been documenting stuff like this for two years now, and it is valuable to see a church that is still small begin to learn the Jack Hyles system of pastoring by intimidation.
And speaking of pastoring by intimidation, I got this rather cryptic warning from Marty himself last night:
"BTW, Bass, don't become a detective.... what a full life you lead. I also see you have yet to answer some theological questions I posted to you about what you actually believe about the Rapture and future events."
It was amusing to wonder if Marty was trying to threaten me or muster the last of his "pastoral power" and give me an order. Who knows? I have posted openly about my views, and Marty is off on one of his "if anybody does something I call sin, I am justified in committing my sin" tangent.
But what really gives the lie to Marty's claim that he never posted as Over It is that
1) the story gets more intricate every time he tells it.
2) Marty and Over It share the same spelling error. I ran a count last night on the spelling error "of coarse," which Marty, as a Hyles-Anderson graduate who took the equivalent of a sixth grade class in English, often misspells. Since March of 2003, Marty has used this misspelling 18 times. Over It has used it in five posts (but six times altogether, as it appears twice in one of the five posts), and a short timer troll named Pastor Raymond (also created by Marty, I assume) used it once.
3) Marty and Over It have identical ethics and methods regarding personal responsibility. Both rely on the premise that wrongdoing (or what they view as wrongdoing) committed by another person entitles them to commit wrongs. In fact, in one post, Marty seems to be insisting that he is not Over It because I do not believe in a rapture. If you've ever raised children, you've heard this logic before. It's called blameshifting, and it's a sign of guilt.
4) Other elements such as the timing of the way that Over It and Marty both stay away for roughly the same time periods and come on at the same time periods have probably been noted by others on the forum.
I don't think trolling is all that serious, but I do think that when a pastor does it so that he can sidestep his pastoral responsibilities to lead a sober and dignified life he is indicating that he is unfit to hold church office. And certainly, the constant lying and blame shifting about the matter reveals an awful lot about Marty's character and the way he runs his church.
